1st steps

as comp gamblers when we have money its NEVER enough and when we dont have money we WANT that little bit more....its the greed inside us all...the gambler talking.....a good thing i learned on here was we cannot win cause we cannot stop....unfortunately these thoughts whizzing around in your head are gathering pace at the minute....dont be too hard on yourself get them barriers back up for him and you will once again be the proud mother that you are..chin up youve proved this CAN be done

I feel I have only proved it can be partially done - will I never be able to relax again, or to trust him again? I hope so - I will give him all the support he needs - but no more money. I am finding it a bit difficult to feel positive today - time will tell and heal the hurt I suppose. x

Hi and sorry to hear about the setback with your son's recovery. Ive had the occasional set back myself but I soon get back on track and so can your son if he wants to. Going to Ga and exploring counselling options are positive steps. Here's a few more thoughts....

Firstly I never say to myself "I will never gamble again.." Am sure all Cg's have said this to themselves when in crisis and emotional turmoil. However for me saying this creates to much pressure within me.. and potentially sets me up for another fall. All I say to myself nowadays is "I will not gamble today".. and then repeat this the next day. Its surprising how quickly gambling free time builds up doing it this way. In any case we can only live life one day at a time anyway. I am learning to stay in the here and now and not forcast into the future.

Secondly.. if your son does not want you to have oversight of his finances then don't have oversight of his finances. Its got to come from him you see.. do you see what I mean? ... this is his recovery to work at or not as the case maybe... its his life. You cant do live it for him.

Likewise by paying off his debts this is not helping him in my opinion. Its unfortunate that most compulsive gamblers do have to fully feel the consequences of our gambling in order to motivate ourselves to want to change and to keep on changing. This is true for me for sure and even then it is not easy. My thought is to require him to repay you even if its only £10 a month. Thats what i pay my dad and have been doing for the last 4.5 years.

Thirdly, gambling addiction is an emotional problem. Their is nothing logical or rational about it. Will power tends not to be enough. The gambling in my opinion is a response to how the person feels within.. it has little to do with money.. though when in action am sure most Cg's me inlcuded will convincce themselves that it is all about money and the thrill of winning.

When in action dopamine and adrenaline are surging through the veins. Even simply anticiapting gambling can be a very very intense emotional experince that blocks out all rational all logical thinking. I am not saying this as an excuse for gambling but just trying to give some insight as i see it. It is a very powerful compulsion.

In my opinion the best thing thhat you can do is set firm boundaries around money and encourage your son to keep talking. he may not want to open up with you.. thats where ga comes in and counselling comes in. take a step back allow your son to make his mistakes. We all make mmistakes in life. Remember he has not behaved as he has in order to hurt you.

gee ive gone on a bit.. sorry about that.. all the best to you both. Your son has been a good support to me over the months. I remmber to keep on smiling 🙂

Thank you - that does make sense. However, without someone overseeing his bank - he messes up. For a whole year, he knew I was logging in to his on-line banking and he managed brilliantly, even having a bit over every month. Then, when he wanted to gamble again, he changed his bank and said he could manage it himself. That was in June - when he started to gamble again. So I feel that he still needs someone strong to oversee his activity with money - or he will just keep falling off the track again. He says that is what he wants - until he decides he wants to lie and gamble - then all the rules change. I didn't explain very well about bailing him out - he is paying me back at £200 per month and he was doing so well - he has never missed a payment - even through his latest gambling spell, he always paid me my loan and his dad's mortgage (his dad bailed him out the first time) So he knows all about having to pay the price because he has hardly any of his salary left - he is paying out all his debts in more manageable chunks to me and his dad and one other loan company. We did it to avoid him having crippling interest added every month. But how do you help someone to change, when they say they "cannot help it"? When he is rational and not gambling, he is articulate, intelligent and effective. Then he turns to gambling, lying, borrowing and seemingly having absolutely no conscience at all (if I am honest, he turns into someone I do not like at all - even though I still love him as my son, if that makes sense)

How on earth did I get back to square one that seemed oh so far away.. I cant remember the first day I gambled. I don't even know why I gambled but I know since I did the last 3 months of my life have been utter hell. I feel so sad and disappointed in my self. I'v once again let myself but more importantly my mum and gf who are too nice and too supportive and 2 people I probably don't deserve.

Well where do I go from here. Positive thoughts even though I feel lower and low. I attended my 1st GA meeting on Fri in Bolton. Strange really and not what I expected and really enjoyed it. Gonna book counselling sessions today and that makes me feel extremely nervous. Am the sort of person who would laugh about people who see councillors as shallow or as wrong as that sounds. Will be attending GA every week and make changes once again.

I still c*t understand if it was me who actually wanted to gamble and why. It's like I dnt even actually know who I am. Or more importantly the compulsive Gambler I become. As me as a person I feel good and nice and kind caring intelligent and thoughtful. Yeh quite pig headed but I like to think positive like that. Then I look over my shoulder after gambling and it's like the worst car wreck possible. Emotions up the wall anger issues where does it all stem from. What was my trigger. I seriously am refusing to ever gamble again. One day at a time maybe but I seriously c*t live my life like this.

I'v hurt too many people and it eats me up inside.

I mean I self excluded and that same bookmakers allowed me in placing bets and even on my debit card. I wanted to punch the guy behind the counter on my last trip as it's as if they know. They see how you bet how frantic you are how ruthless with money and there asking you if you would like a tea or coffee. I mean if I seen sum1 with a problem I'd like to think I would try and help. But no not bookmakers the onus is on the gambler... Well this gambler is gonna be no more. I'm going to take you up on your offer. Financially I end up out of control but the person I am after gambling and found is the better person who I am going to be. I couldn't post on here as I would have felt guilty having gambled and being back on here.

Onwards and upwards and thanks to my mum and gf to support this time will be the last time. I love them both far too much to let this beat me and in turn them. ODAAT. Keep smiling all..

P.S I would like to thank GA for making me give a therapy as I came out and told my last hidden truth (lie). No more where gambling is concerned..

Likewise your thoughts make sense.. gambling can and does create a jeckl and Hyde type character. Nobody new the life i led until my world came crashing down. An intelligent and articulate son and an Uncle that my all my neices and nephews loved to see (and would cry when i left) any yet a gambling J****E at the same time.. albeit out of sight. My life had compartments all very separate from each other. I am trying to change this.

My mum once said to me.. "if you gamble until you are homeless and hungry i would be very sad.. but it would have been your choice".. she then went on to say.. "do not approach any member of the family for money.. you will not get any ". Those thoughts have stayed with me... and they have helped me. They help me to take responsibility for myself. If I empty my bank account gambling there is no fall back position any more. I choose to work recovery as best I can. I hope this helps a little to put things into perspective.. S.A

P.s Hi PSOWN... just red your thoughts after i posted... you will get back on track am sure.. just as i am doning.. one day at a time.. keep smiling.. S.A 🙂

Your mum sounds like a very wise lady. I too have told my son that this was the VERY last time he will get any sort of financial support from me. At 27 years old, he earns enough to be able to have a nice life if he chooses - he knows this. So if he chooses to gamble, that is his choice but he can no longer drag me down with him - I want a nice life - I work hard and deserve better. I so want him to be happy - I wish I could understand his triggers, but if he cannot understand them himself (as he says above), then how can I understand and help? It is all so frustrating, I am so sad, even typing this makes me want to cry. x

Hello.

I read both of your posts from today and said that i'd read the full diary at home. I've just done so. It is some story. If it's OK, I'd like to share some thoughts, but first a little intro on myself...

I'm only 5 months clean and doing lots of 'work' on this gambling addiction. GA for me, GAMANON for my wife and parents, a diary on this site, counselling at the start and reading a fair bit on what 'recovery' means. I worry a lot that I might lapse and break the promises that I made to myself, my wife, my kids and my family. I don't want to gamble and I'm confident that I won't but its not that simple because this addiction creeps up on you when you are not watching or tempts you to have an 'innocent' bet. It always spirals out of control from that first bet. I've heard so much of it in GA and here. The more I hear, the more I worry. This is why your diary is a tremendous story... to teach people that no matter how well recovery is going and the longer since the last bet, that the 1st bet stays the same distance away. Always.

A few thoughts:

1) Congratulations PSOWM for coming back and typing your most recent post. Takes guts to do that. Your recovery seemed to be going great. The initial counting of days and then replacing that with enjoying life and Christmas etc.. 'Peg' on these boards had a phrase "nothing changes if nothing changes". It seemed like you had made changes, had you ?

2) To WM, my heart goes out to you. My wife has experience of alcohol in her family and now me as a CG.... ouch!.... it works well because I get the benefit of all her 'work' before we met. When I say benefit, it probably means that I get it in the neck promptly and often. She says that the family and partners of a CG can become more sick than the addict themselves. She was at counselling tonight.... for what its worth, I think that counselling and GAMANON would be a great idea. You know best but you need to be able to deal with your anger, frustration, sadness too. Just my opinion. Sory if I sound like I'm preaching... I don't mean to and most definitely am not qualified to do so.

3) PSOWM, you know the drill. The blocks, the ODAAT etc.. Having a lapse, even if it is a biggie, is not the end of the world. You dust yourself off and learn from it. That's the only thing you can do. Trying to do things differently, perhaps. The seasoned guys I meet in GA seem to have a simple view of recovery which i sometimes find strange as I try to over-analyse my recovery. They say it is as simple as "Just for Today, I will not gamble". Apologies if this somewhat conflicts with earlier comment about 'change'.

4) PSOWM, if it helps, I, as an anonymous person but a fellow CG who has battled this for many years would be happy to exchange email addresses or phone numbers if there comes a time that you need some support from someone that fights the same battle as you. Let me know.

5) Finally, PSOWM, I think that you need to battle this on your own two feet. Your last bailout has happened... for the sanity of your mother. (3rd bailout?) Your mother has a lot of issues to unravel as part of your gambling recovery. There is tremendous support available, most of it free. Please consider it carefully.

Most of all, best of strength to both of you.

Brian

Hi Brian

And thank you for taking the time to read our story and to post your most helpful and insightful thoughts. I agree with all you say - and last time I definitely thought we had made all the right steps and put the correct blocks in place. However, my son can be extremely persuasive (and devious) and convinced me (against my better judgement ..... but was I too willing to be convinced?) that he was now ready to stand on his own two feet.

Therefore he changed banks to one that gave him a huge overdraft at 0% and told me he would pay off his last remaining commercial loan. He then refused to give me the bank details, obviously that was when the recent decline happened. What I struggle to understand is why? He is intelligent, articulate, organised and has a good job - so he knows exactly what he is doing. A part of me says he has a facet of himself that is selfish, greedy and has to have what he wants, even when he cannot afford it. That makes me think that maybe we instilled the wrong values into him as a youngster, although his siblings do not have the same issues.

He was always a "golden boy". Outgoing personality, attractive, good at football, popular with his peers and girls .... and maybe we celebrated that too much and skewed his values? Just guessing - I have no real ideas. I am a very down to earth person and quite selfless in some ways - I bailed him out last week with money from my business - the day after my car had a much needed repair that I could not afford and I had to put that on my credit card ....... but I know I can manage that debt and am able to be strict and pay it off - he is unable (or unwilling?) to do that.

I am confused as to whether I should be supportive or angry and at the moment I am a bit of both. And at 55 years old, I do not want to have to manage his life (as well as my own) for ever, I looked forward to him managing his own money and feeling confident and independent - now I cannot see that happening for a long, long time - if ever.

Strangely, once he has confessed and it is all out in the open, he is happy and is content to have no money and to have me managing and overseeing everything - is that just refusing to take responsibility?

Finally, he and his girlfriend went to Gamblers Anonymous last week and found it helpful. If he ever wants me to go I will do so, but not for myself, I would do it if he needed it. Having yet another thing I have to do in the limited time I have available, would just give me more stress - coming on here, conversing with people like you, talking to my son and chatting to the on line counsellors is sufficient for me. I pray daily that he manages to overcome this awful side of his personality because without it, he is the most lovely boy you could wish for.

When I am angry, I am certain it is all just a refusal to grow up and take responsibility, when I am in supportive mode, I think he has unresolved issues that he refuses to address .... maybe both bits are true. Thank you again. x

he is young and doesnt understand the meaning of money....i am 40 in jan and struggle myself,even if i have money in my pocket now i will spend it (not on gambling tho)..my mother has a cash card for me.... i guess in life we have to go so far before we realise what mistakes we make...i only hope the lads time comes sooner than later as it cost me thousands before i realised...we are all devious and greedy in this evil whilst in his best interests you keep bailing him out maybes its time for him to stand on his own two feet and start looking into the real world...i should know i was pampered for years as well....sorry if im sticking my nose into your business...

You are not poking your nose in at all! All advice and experiences are very welcome as I am in a place I do not understand .... I have never had those urges and have always been fairly sensible with money (when I have had any!) I know you are right about bailing him out - I only did it really to avoid his dad being turfed out of his house as he took out a mortgage to bail him out last time (well, actually the time before .... I bailed him out last time ...!) And the loans he had taken out were adding crippling interest every day and I worried that the outcome would be him taken to court and then having a charge put on the house - which would have been grossly unfair to his dad who put his house on the line to help him 2 years ago. I really do not have any answers - all I know is this is the last time I will be able to help him financially. Because I need to work less, not more ..... and I want to be able to have a little money for me! Thanks for your input. x

WM,

If it's OK with you, can I please up the ante (pardon the pun) on my previous mail...

GA is for compulsive gamblers and Gamanon is for partners and those affected by gamblers. The agenda is totally different between the two sessions and I don't think your son's girlfriend or yourself would get an awful lot out of going to GA. I think (and again, excuse my butting in) that if your son's girlfriend was to go to Gamanon she would get the help she needs. I've never been to gamanon as gamblers are not allowed but I understand they deal with stuff like:

- How to handle your own emotions of living with a gambler

- Learning about the tricks they play and learning about the addiction. Listening to other stories of people affected by cg's.

- Helping yourself as someone who has been dragged into this addiction through no fault of your own. Talking about YOU not HIM.

- Many families and partners of cg's can be too supportive or perhaps controlling as part of the recovery process and aparently it helps with discussing stuff like that.

They typically have Gamanon sessions running at the same time in a different room to GA sessions. I'll leave it at that.

Best of strength to you all,

Brian

Afternoon all. My picture is becoming clearer and without gambling my whole outlook on life is different. So why do I do it. The million dollar question I guess. Do I know? Don't I know? Do I hide from the answers or do I have the answer but am yet to find out? Questions flying around my head but all can't be dealt with at once. Winning post Brian and any1 else I have missed off thanks again for your brutal honesty and support for me my gf and my mum. Sometimes it's a bitter pill to swallow but one I must take all the same. My last bet was last Tues so I am thinking that I have now done a week. It's no hard at all ODAAT but how did I end up back here. Perhaps constant reminders of the pain may keep me away along with will power and support. NO more excuses and lies the onus is on me and me alone. Blame it on what you like but I am beating this. Good luck all in your individual recoveries and journeys and to anybody supporting. ODAAT Keep smiling 🙂

For today I won't gamble. Up bright and early after a nice night. Cooked tea for the gf then had a gd training session. Funny how with no stress on your mind u play better?? Anyway been analysing everything since messing up and betting again and have had brain meltdown so trying to have a bit of a relax on that front. Barriers are set up once again and I begin the battle and long journey of trying to win trust. My last bet was last Tues so the long journey starts and we re now on day 8... Feels horrible being back here. Note to self. Don't EVER do this again! ODAAT Keep Smiling all 🙂 and good luck

Nice to read your positive post and hope you can see it through this time. I am slightly jealous that you seem bright and breezy and back on track and we (the rest of us "in the know") seem to have taken on all the worry that should be yours .... perhaps that is part of the problem?

I feel like I have been in a battle and am battered and bruised. I don't want to know why you do it, I just don't want you to do it - and if you do I want you to sort it out - I think I still feel quite angry that I seem to have been left "holding the baby" so to speak. I am not sure if me being angry is bad for your recovery but I cannot help it, I am angry - angry, tired and upset and feel that I have to shoulder the worry whilst you have "confessed", passed all the responsibility onto others, and gone on your merry way.

I have many financial pressures at present, because I consciously took a step back from working too much, in order to improve my health ....... a lot of good that did me! Anyway, I don't want to spoil the positive mood with my moaning ..... just thought I needed to inject a little realism - all is not bright and rosy - we are yet again at the foot of a very big hill, I just hope I have enough strength to walk up it! The anger does not diminish my love and support, but it needs to be said.

Thanks Brian also for your post above - I think I may attend because it will be helpful to see how others tackle their feelings and get through it successfully, with relationships intact!

xx