Does counseling work?

Hi Four leaf clover, You are sounding so much more positive. I'm really pleased for both of you. Its a step in the right direction. Who knows what the future may hold, but you are taking control of what you can control, yourself. Its all you can do. Its taken my husband and I almost 6 months to even start to move forward, something you've done much quicker. Counselling was the key for us, once I started to move forward then my husband followed. We still have a very long way to go, but, hey, we have the rest of our lives to go at our respective pace.

Ldriver talks a lot of sense, you can feel his pain, but you can also hear the determination to turn his life around. It can be done. I too have found the support of other gamblers very helpful, my husband was unable to talk about what was going on in his head, he was in denial for quite a while. The input from those in recovery was what saved our marriage and helped me to look after me, made me realise that I was in recovery too. Take care, continue to post , you are in charge of your destiny, Love Ostrich x

Hi Ostrich, thanks for your words and thoughts. it's so confusing and confronting at times. i wish it would go away at times. but i can see how i've got to fix this in myself as well. even if he and i don't stay/get back together, i fear i'll just choose somebody else with a variance of the same theme.

an ex-boyfriend came to visit yesterday (he lives in a different country and is holidaying here) and i could see how his problems, although different, were the same. he thinks he can and does manipulate many situations, not tell the truth, so blatantly we all know it and nothing he says is ever completely trusted. it's a shame cause i don't even think he can trust himself. i don't think he's intentionally trying to hurt anyone just is completely clueless to everyone else's needs. a different set of issues, but similar enough that one can assume i need to learn a big lesson here.

i would like to be free from the desires/entrapment of trying to create drama in my life. to set boundaries and to enjoy helping people but not rescuing them. to see circumstances as reflections of what is going on, accept that there will be bad times, but i am not a victim or powerless.

he attended his his first GA meeting today. he was really happy afterward. he said that there were people there from all different walks of life and varying degrees, but the theme was all the same. the lies and the hurt, lying to those people around them.

he said that he has no excuses that he needs to go every week for the rest of his life. there was a guy there that had not gambled in 26 years. how inspiring is that? he wants to go to church with me tomorrow. he's doing all the 'right' things at the moment. i guess after being lied to so much, i'm hesitant to believe he has completely changed and that this will last. (the wall - we'll see) but in the mean time, i'm working on me and i'm going to be free from being a victim.

I went to my first Gam Anon meeting last night. Was terrified before going - still a little scared right now thinking about it. As the counselor that I had seen said, don't go for him, but for you. I really tried to go for me and explain that that was why I was there. Some people got it, I think, but some people are in different situations - if it's their brother/sister/son/daughter obviously they have not 'chosen' to have that person in their life like a partner/relationship.

There was a lot of talk of the lies and the hurt that is told and there was a book of steps for us too. I will read through them. One of them was to make a list of the people and hurt that you have done. Which is true, as a person that enabled it, by accepting the lies, buying the groceries, paying for things, I was hurting himself, myself, the people close to me (my family) because, truly I resented that. I resented that I was spending the money. I resented that I wasn't being cared for. I was cranky, but he had debts - some of which he explained - some of which he didn't or didn't mention so I just thought I was supporting him. Seeing him now and not having to pay for everything - we're sharing buying things equally, is enormously liberating.

I miss having him next to me each night, but I have stopped having nightmares. For a few days, that's all I could think of, the last and the first things I thought of as I went to sleep and woke up would be of him gambling.

I still doubt what he tells me and he says that I have every right to ask questions.

He also said that he was going to get a book and write all his money/keep his receipts in there. I asked him last night if he had done that he said 'oh no, I should have got that today.' He can be forgetful full stop, and he has made a lot of good steps to recovery - but do I trust that he 'forgot?'

He has

- seen a doctor (apparently his doctor is away at the moment) been prescribed anti-depressants (he's hesitant to take them)

- gone to a G.A. meeting

- going to another G.A. meeting tonight

- has said that he will come to the G.A. meeting that is run co-currently with the one that I am going to

- has gone to church (and even sung)

- going to counseling (and booked another appointment - next available is early April)

- written a list of 'the lies/mistruths he can remember he has told me

- written a list of people he owes money to

- says he understands that this is a disease and will be in recovery for the rest of his life (that means going to GA for the rest of his life)

- points out TABs when we drive past and says they make him feel unwell

- has a list of numbers he can call if he has an urge

- has made a plan to pay back the people that he owes

- is researching to go back to uni and where/how that will work

- is considering moving to live near his daughter (in a while - to have shared custody)

- tells me that if all we can be is friends then he will have to accept that, but he still wants me in his life.

Things I am worried about:

- Is he telling me the whole truth

- are the lists complete?

- Is he going to fall of the wagon in a a few months time?

- Is he really going to go back to uni?

- Are his parents going to enable him? (will he be strong enough to stand up to them?)

- Is his emotional intelligence so good, he's two steps ahead of everyone else?

- Is he still suicidal and not telling anyone?

- does he really want to 'get real' with himself?

Things I want to change in me

- not to see myself as the victim

- to sustain boundaries

- to buy a place to live - that is still try and and save to buy a place (sooooo expensive, such a long term goal!)

- to face up that this is my issue

- to be able to make decisions that are based on the truth/my feelings and not get sick because I am denying those feelings and creating angst within myself

- to stand up to my family who desperately want me to be the victim so they can be the persecutor/rescuer (victim as well, in some cases) setting my boundaries and showing that I am a person who is capable in my own right.

Things I am proud of

- I have attended the meetings

- I am taking ownership

- I am starting to stand up to people

- I am re-framing situations so that I am not the victim

- I am each day, asking God for help

- I am re-stating when I need to (usually when asked, by him) that I need to know that he has changed and only time will tell that. I love him, he's my best friend none of that needs to be doubted or questioned, but I ned to know if he's changed and if I have the emotional/physical (that is not getting sick) strength to endure this for the rest of my life.

Things I am proud of in him

- He's making steps

- He's reading the Bible

- He's trying to really listen to me

- Hopefully he really has stood up to his parents

- He's trying to take control back of his life

- He's admitting to the lies

- He doesn't get cross when I question him, but tells me I should, because I have lost faith in him.

hey fourleafclover,

I see your making headway, whether it is good or bad realisations, its good to see progress. I get the impression you are trying extremely hard and I do hope he is too. You are really trying to put some sort order on it and I have to commend the two of you. I know its really hard work, but only time and honesty can bring that trust back. It cant be rushed and we have to accept the situation we are in. Please God and with faith I hope everything will work out for you. Keep doing what your doing. God Bless the two of you Best of luck.

Thanks ldriver, you're right, it is tempting to feel like i should 'rush' through this. but that is one thing that i am trying hard not to do. last night he said that he had finally realised that his happiness was not dependent on me - something i hadn't thought about myself. i guess i still depend on him to feel happy (that is, i get up and one of the first things i do is check for an email from him). he bought me a book about being creative and happy each day and today it said that i should focus on the small tasks that i do and achievements that i make and be happy about that. a self-esteem issue (we should be happy with ourselves in our own right - soo much easier said than done!)

he said last night that he finally felt at peace with us because he had 'let go' and that whatever happened happened, i explained that is how i feel that i can't determine which way things are going to go, but that we deal with things one day at a time.

he didn't like the GA group that he went to as much as the one he went to on saturday - he said it was the same message but a different vibe, so he will keep going to the other one. i hope this is an O.k. thing to think?

he has bought a book and started stapling in his receipts - i think it's probably a good thing to do for anyone - really show where you spend your money and where you can save.

Also, in the gam anon book it said some things to strive for and one was to strive from mis-trust to trust. how do you do that? i just don't know.

I feel numb. We met up yesterday and I quizzed him on something, it turns out he lied again to me. He still maintains he hasn't gambled but is still lying. we met up again today (as it is my birthday) and i asked that as a birthday present he give me the 'truth' more truths came out (last night and then). They hurt so much. I still love him. He's going to GA tonight. he rung his friend who he lied to and told him he lied. I'm so worried about him and I love him so much. the lies hurt so much. i'm hurting. how do you ever trust?

I'm so tired of all the lies. He says 'again' that he is so happy because there is nothing left to tell me. That's he said all the 'major' stuff. It's so weird. How do you support not counsel? How do you love but with a wall? how do you encourage for telling the truth but show how much the lies hurt. i rang him last night in tears ad tears and tears and he listened to me cry and cry as I said how alone I felt, I tried so hard all day yesterday to not feel sorry for myself, I always made a big thing of birthdays, but I just felt numb and hid away. I cut my cake with mum and dad and went down stairs and he called him and cried.

I'm pleased he's telling the truth. But, it hurts so much all of the lies. I guess it's those inner voices that say if we tell this no one will forgive or love us. We have no faith in human kind. We forgive and forgive each other but never ourselves and we keep these secrets as if we are broken, but we're not and everyone has stuff that is bad and shameful that they have done, even thoughts alone. When we say them to someone else, their response is usually, oh, is that all, that's no big deal. So it's a vicious circle to listen to the voices that tell us to be quiet, when all that does is c*****e the situation. So i want to encourage him for being open and honest, but I don't want to 'permit' or 'enable' the lies.

He rung his mum in front of me to say that he had to sort some stuff out and that he had been lying again, and she started excusing him, saying 'you've been through a lot, you're just lying to protect yourself, she's manipulating and using you.' he ended up yelling at her to stop letting him get away with it and excusing him, because he was the one doing it.

He rung a counseling line at lunch the next day, cause he said he just wanted to stop lying, but didn't know how. They said that he was doing everything he could, going the counseling and attending GA (they said at Gam Anon that the more sessions you go to in 30 days, the better it is) he's been to 3 sessions so far and has plans to go to more on the weekend/end of the week.

I'm so scared he'll keep gambling, lying and I'm scared that I actually like the drama in some twisted/subconscious way I enjoy feeling the pain. Not sure if that thought is true or not, possibly something to explore.

I'm getting to the roller coast point here. Up and down, I'm mad, angry, upset, realise that's pointless, so am calm, o.k. etc... ughh.... when will the ride end? or does it ever end?

Someone at work today said an off-hand comment - having no idea about my thoughts and situation, said that you're better to marry a husband that has a good job so that he can support you when you have kids....

i don't even know if i want kids. how serious do we take these things? i just feel like the whole world is running ahead and i'm left behind....

Hi Fourleafclover, it is a rollercoaster ride, but its his rollercoaster. You can chose to get on or off. Its difficult to make decisions when your emotions are all over the place. Sometimes just deceiding what to wear or what to eat is enough. I understand about the lack of trust, every time you think thats everything, something else comes out, or stirs up a memory of past lies and deceit, and wow, your emotions kick in and the ride starts all over again. But the ride will last only as long as you let it. This is where you take care of you. Whatever is happening with your b/f is in his control. You can't control that. Just as the Cgs say, one day at a time. Be strong, look after yourself, do whats right for you. love Ostrich x

Thanks Ostrich, you are absolutely right. I am 'owning' a problem that is not mine. I guess it's bizarre when you think about all of the things I used to believe. I used to believe the lies. I sometimes suspected, like the time money went missing out of my wallet. (He now says was because he had gambled everything and needed money to get to work). I thought i had spent it somewhere and was just so forgetful I could not remember. He even helped me look for it. On my birthday I asked him for (again) after asking for so many times and he admitted to it finally. I suspect that he has taken more than that. He said that he paid me back and I do have a vague memory of having more money in my wallet than I thought one day, but, as he says, that's not the point. The point is he took it, lied, pretended, lied and lied again about it.

I wish he was a horrible person so I could just walk away.

He is at a GA meeting now. He seems to like this one the best as it was friendly last week apparently. I have GamAnon tomorrow night. I am looking forward to talking about the problems. But suspect that not all of the advice given/suggested is good. Am a bit annoyed when I heard things like, "gamblers like to sleep when they're coming down..." "they'll either be talkative or quiet after the meetings." etc.. generalisations that I know are not true. Am choosing to overlook these and focus on what I can get out of it.

It feels like this week I have lost a bit of focus from gambling is his problem, mine is the 'victim' philosophy that I carry around with me.

I had an incident this week where I got really upset and was the victim, instead of buying into it, I got upset (initial reaction), cut contact with the person (who I frankly believe hurts everyone as has no regard for anyone but themselves), re-framed the situation in mind (attempted to) look at it like, I am not the victim. I set my boundaries, they broke them, knowing full well that I would be upset with this, they justified their actions rather than apologising, this is not the first, second, third (or probably 100th) time I have had my trust broken by this person, so I am choosing to act in a way that I can to withdraw from putting myself in similar situations again. I am not the victim, this is a timely opportunity for me to practice setting and following through with my boundaries.

Just came back from Gam-Anon, it was much more supportive. He came along and went to the GA meeting in the other room. Was really helpful being able to talk about things and the chairperson said that I was doing really well.

We spent the day together. It's always hard because he wants to know there's a future sometimes. But, I can't say that at this time. We went to church this morning and the sermon was on, "I will never be the same again." He was crying by the end of the service and we prayed a few different times today. We spoke about different things and I feel so much better for going to the meeting. I kind of wish it wasn't a week before the next one. It feels like an eternity since I was last there!

Just wanted to get on here and write because I'm trying to make it a habit I feel it really helpful as well as hearing other people's perspectives.

Hey fourleafclover, may I commend you on your guts and determination in what your doing. I haven't been very positive the last week or so, its like i've been on a roller coaster. I've been missing my ex during the week, but was asked out on a date on friday night and I went. I was confused about going in the first place, as I felt if she's moving on well I should to. So was trying to be positive but as soon as I went on the date I just felt wrong. I missed her more than ever. What do I do as she says there's no hope yet I'm making such a huge effort but I suppose too little too late. But it just really hurts me that my broken heart won't go away. Its like another cross to bear and i'm already faltering with the addiction. Anyway enough of my rant as I do feel a little better this evening. i just want to run away at times but you can't run away from your head. But i know its really tough for you, and who know's what will happen but all you can do is your best and no more and he the same. I'm reading your daily posts and I must say I wish my girlfriend was doing what you are, i hope your boyfriend really appreciates what your doing. With you being an active church goer you will know what divine provedence is, i may have mentioned it previously but GOD works in mysterious ways and if we be positive and try and do the right things he will help us find happiness. Keep the faith.

Thanks for your encouragement ldriver, I definitely would not be doing all of this, if I hadn't gone to counseling and had it pointed out to me that there was a reason he was attracted to me and I was attracted to him, that's related to addictions. I'm on this journey for myself, selfishly I know, I do support him and do things for him, but I need to go to Gam-Anon for myself, I need to go to counseling for myself and I need to write my thoughts for myself. I want to break the cycle of addictive behaviours in my relationships, be they as overt as this, but I can see in every relationship how I bought into the drama triangle. I thank my counselor for pointing this out, though, it's a hard journey!

ldriver, I know what you mean about dating, It's weird. He and I were talking last night and he said that if things don't work out with us that he will have to tell the girl that he is dating almost straight away and be really upfront about it. I think we all have things we feel we need to say in a relationship, to be honest, but this is something I would also encourage him to disclose, he said that he's prepared that he may just be single for the rest of his life. How do you know when to say something? and if you're heartbroken, you're just going to be more upset. I remember breaking up with my boyfriend a couple of years ago. It took me about 6 months to get over it, then I saw him again and I was almost back to square one again. (life... 🙂

It's hard to think about everything that has happened. But then I step back and try and work out which of the issues are mine, which are his and which are combined. I'm lucky he's a great communicator, but unlucky cause like all he likes to say what makes people happy, although, I have seen him give bad news to people and he is skilled at that too, so not quite sure why he feels the need to make up stories to confront the truth (again, not my issue on that one).

He's getting back into his life and doing somethings that he should have done years ago, so that's a positive. Sometimes, though, I still doubt his stories, wonder if he is making them up and wonder why he would need to?

I wish sometimes there was a magical telescope into the future!

At the begining of your last post you express how your doing your recovery for you and if it seems selfish, so be it. The thing is, it is not selfish, what your doing is correct. If we try and make ten people happy, you will find no one is happy, but at least if you concentrate on yourself and make yourself happy well at least one person is happy. That may sound selfish at first, but if everyone made a point of making themselves happy and worrying about themselves we wouldn't need to make each other happy. I first read this statement in a book on acceptance, and I myself was a bit taken aback by it, i thought it was an incredibly selfish statement. But when i chatted with my counsellor she explained it to me and made so much sense.

I suppose my heart ache is not being helped by the fact i'm doing well and I have this overwhelming feeling that my ex should have just hung on in there, as I know it would have been tough but I think we may have fallen in love all over again. Every minute of everyday she is with me in thought, and although my spontaneous bursts of tears are becoming less I know how much I love her. Sometimes you just have to let the person you love go, and thats the hardest thing in the world for me.

I notice aswell your boyfriend says that he would have to tell the girl at the start if he's dating. I disagree with that as you will never find anyone that way. If and when you find someone else you will know when the time is right, and it doesn't matter who you are everyone has stuff they don't want other people to know and everyone has their vices albeit some worse than others but if you really feel that you love the person and your honest with yourself and know your not gambling than you will have no problem telling the other person. Enough of my rant, fourleaf you give me hope and I thank you for that. I really respect you for all that your doing as you chose the hard road on which to carry your cross and that has to be truly commended. I think your being a wonderful person and stick with it.

Hi

I'm new to this site, but not new to living with a gambling addict. I have been with my boyfriend for 4 years and I found out three years ago that he had stolen from me and opened up credit cards in my name. I didn't realise it was a gambling problem at first. I forgave him, set up a repayment scheme and tried to move on. 6 months later I found out he hadn't been making the repayments and had got into more debt. He admitted then that he thought he had a gambling problem. Again I forgave him, I took out a 10 thousand pound loan to pay off all the credit cards and again I set up a repayment system for him to pay me back and pay the loan off. I found him an additional job to help as well. I had been so proud of him and everything I thought he had achieved I was finally starting to see the end of the nightmare I was in and thought the debts would soon be paid off and we could start enjoying the money we earned, maybe buy a house, get married, have kids, until on Saturday I found out that he has been gambling since last September, that he has not been making the full repayments he promised to pay, that he has stolen money from my account again. That again he is overdrawn, in the last 10 days alone £300 has gone from my account, I need to go to the bank to find out the full extent of the damage, which I am dreading. He is saying exactly the same things he said 2 years ago. That he can't lose me, that this will never happen again, that we can be so happy together. He has promised that he can still repay all his debts within 18 months.

I have told him he must tell his parents, but he is refusing. I asked him to leave, but when it came down to it I couldn't see him go. It is ironic that he has caused me all this pain, but he is the only person who can comfort me.

I admire anyone who can leave a person like this, because I know I am not strong enough.