FOBT's

About five years ago a former tenant of my flat had a big envelope from a bookmaker arrive. We had mail from this guy for five years and it always got sent back with "no longer at this address" across the front. This time my curiosity got the better of me.

Turns out this bloke was a shareholder with that company and the envelope contained their annual report. It made for some pretty interesting reading. This particular bookie (and I would imagine the case is the same for them all) made more profit from machine play than they made from all football, horse racing and sports betting combined. When you consider there are at least four UK meetings a day, with over fifty UK matches a week that's pretty staggering. The clue is the the name - fixed odds. They aren't fixed in our favour!

Hi Kim - what a lovely surprise to hear from you and really hope you are well. Hope you have not been buying too many shoes!

I did have a browse to see if I could find you a while back but assumed you had left the site as you had not posted for a while.

For me the roulette machines are long gone and self exclusion just over 3 years ago did the trick along with all your encouragement.

As always you have got me thinking - I did not consider people reading posts but not commenting so maybe the thread helps more people than I assumed.

Really is good to hear from you and makes me feel very comfortable that you are still around.

Dave x

Thanks for your thoughts vtr - they make so much money from these machines and people wonder why they lose money themselves.

They are, and always will be there to take, take, take and the sooner people realise the sooner they will stop playing into their hands!

Best wishes

Dave

Hi found this thread really interesting as I am generally a moderate gambler but have become hooked on these machines losing sometimes a few hundred in one sitting. I absolutely hate myself after I play them as I'm intelligent enough to realise that they are a racket! I go in with 20 and end up running back and forward to the cash machine before I realise I've blew 250 in 20 minutes! I've stopped online roulette and want to stop playing in the bookies too! Tired of feeling depressed, angry, shell shocked, stressed, worried and then going back days later and playing them again! They are truly evil and life wreckers! Hopefully I can nip this in the bud before it wrecks my life!!!

Hi husky

Like yourself I was hooked on these machines. Maybe you should try the challenge set by MR brightside. 33 days and counting without these machines and a lot better off. Just spent 100 on clothes which would of been unthinkable last month if it wasn't for the support of the group.

Hope your well and join us along with everyone else who wants to better themselves.

Charlie

Great advice Charlie and well worth a go Husky.

Also try self-excluding from the bookies closest to you at least - if you can't go in you can't play!

You already know you can't win so not going to labour the point. All I will say is if you don't stop playing those machines will take everything you have and more!

Glad you are spending wisely Charlie - how much nicer is it seeing something for your money!

hi, this thread is really interesting and I can identify every single feeling or emotional state which is described. Playing roulette machines has been a problem for over 10 years for me. I have been to GA for 5 years now but never lasted longer than 3-4 months...I find it very hard to change as a person and work on recovery program. After a while of not gambling I feel better but in the back of my mind I get excited and I know I'll be gambling in the future. I always think I won't touch machines just put small fun bets on sports but once you go there it is hard to resist...Also self-excluded myself from all the bookies and has been asked to leave and refused to serve at least 5 times already...At least they remember me so I can't blame the staff any more...Life is so much s... when you play those machines and they take not only money but time, your future plans, ideas. It's very hard to give up on gambling completely and every time I lose I think I'll control it next time and I'll stick to small bets...I was just about to go back to the meetings but stayed in the house again thinking if that's a right place for me if I haven't changed in 5 years...I'm full of lies, agression(smashing doors, machines after play, spitting on the screens, abusing people watching me play or staff) and I hate myself for that...I'm just a normal guy outside the bookies but when playing or just after I feel like I'm a totally different person and my life doesn't make sense...The question is: how can I stop completely and stop believing I can gamble with control and avoid those stupid machines? Debts, overdraft, no value for money, earning a lot by working hard and not having anything but problems...hmmm... The belief and buzz you get when playing roulette is huge and I always think my numbers will come and if they don't I'll try again and I blame myself for making a mistake by not placing a bet on 30 or 23 when I bet on 8 or 11...It's funny how many times I put max over 13 pounds on 0 and it came and even if I walked out I was back the next day and my great betting roulette system was gone again...Wish you all the best and I'm just starting my fourth day free of both machines and any type of gambling. Let's hope this type is much different and I'll never stand in front of those machines again.

Hi Staypositive - I would imagine anyone reading your post and has had or still got any type of problem with not being able to stop playing the roulette machines will instantly get where you are coming from.

As I mentioned in another thread the other day different people find different things exciting and the more exciting we find them the stronger the urges to return for more action so we need to know how to manage the urges when they come along.

Duncs has a brilliant theory which is spot on (hope you don't mind me quoting you Duncs) - to enable you to play the machines when the urges come along three things have to be present:-

1. Time - well a gambler always makes time and if anything is in the way will somehow make the time through not doing other things or lying to get out the house etc

2. Money or the means to gamble such as a credit or debit cards which enables them to either get cash out the bank cash-points or fund the betting via the bookies ATM terminal

3. Something to gamble on - in your case a roulette machine.

As Duncs says, take just one of these away and you simply cannot gamble.

You have self-excluded which is great but do not have enough willpower to stop going in still and are not embarrassed enough when you are asked to leave or they refuse to serve you - you will not be alone here. I would suggest the best option for you would be to limit you accessibility to funds which will mean giving someone your cards / money to look after and not give you them to gamble with however much you ask.

Time and time again on here controlled betting has been discussed on the forum and the answer is simple - for someone who finds gambling so attractive and has the mindset to chase losses it just won't happen. The difficulty is if you have one or two controlled sessions and win you just go back for more and more (and I do thing gamblers are greedy by the way) and eventually you hit 'that' bad run then chase, and that big, big loss occurs. When I used to play them (which I have not for over 3 years now since I self-excluded) even when I won I knew that big loss was always just around the corner - ALWAYS and sometimes was relieved when it happened to get it out the way.

With respect to spitting on the screen - this is disgusting for someone else to have to clear up - it is not the customer services reps fault you lose so this needs to stop. Hitting the machine I can understand but is crazy - it's a machine which is much cleverer than any of us could ever be.

Never forget if you win it always pays you what you are owed!

Like me you are a bad loser and its being a bad loser which prompts the chasing when things do not go as we hoped. Without doubt these machines turn normal everyday people in monsters - I reckon when you win you are one of the nicest guys around and feel like a millionaire!

I and anyone on this site will tell you that in the long term you will never ever, ever, ever win.

Those machines are ultra clever and the numbers you choose are irrelevant as there is no roulette ball and the winning numbers are chosen the second you hit 'spin'. You are simply being brainwashed by a video screen which just looks like a roulette wheel!

You are the only one who can stop this and hopefully this gives you some ideas. I will say it again you will never win but are welcome to keep trying. Equally you are free to cut your losses, be bold enough to say you were trying to accomplish something impossible and learn from the past.

Remember and act on these two things and you will be far happier (and much better off financially)

'I cannot gamble because I cannot stop' and

'I will not gamble today'

I wish you well with whatever you choose.

Dave

hi dave, i am new to this site and have just spent the last 3 hrs reading this thread, my problem is not with the roulette machine but with online slots as its the same logic any gambler uses, im due a big win or i need to win that money back i just lost, the feelings are exactly the same as you have described the buzz when winning then the feeling guilty and down after it has gone back, the online slots also appear to have near/close wins where there will be the same symbol on reels 1345 so it makes you think oh a wins coming , god typing it sounds what an idiot i have been to believe that lol i just want say i have really enjoyed reading your post as it all makes perect sense and it so correct, i am only on day 1 but will be coming back on here every day and hope 1 day will turn to a week, 1 month and so on, keep up the great posts and more poems please x

I had read this thread on a few occasions, even contributed some time ago, I think this thread by Dave is very important, fotb,s are ruining many lives (mine for one) people will continue to play these machines for a variety of reasons (buzz, win money, chase losses) this all leads to addiction. This thread and the conversations within in it need editing and a book producing on the very very important topic of fotb gambling. I am currently in the process of producing a word doc which I intend to send to as many MP's as I can afford stamps in my precarious financial situation will allow. These machines must be better and regulated quickly. Keep discussing fotbs, we all know they promote an even chance play, and anyone who is on this site, knows that is just not true, I want to bring this into the media, how I just don't know, but while I know I shouldn't have been playing these machines, I do believe in an even playing field! I field very angry at being cheated and its time to react.

Hi everyone, any more thoughts outthere on the FOTB machines that rob people in the bookies?. I mean when you think about it are they strictly legal? they raised billions of pounds for the big four bookies in 2012 (nothing published for 2013) so if the machines are an even chance for all?, did the number '0' all on its own raise 150 billion pounds! I don't think so!. So I guess all of us on here re-alise that each game on the 'FOTB machine' has what is called a 'new player winning bonus' if you don't go quick with that offer, the computer/game will take all your stakes in the end (whether it be 10 or 5000), so again I beg the question is by 'offering a fair even chance' a case for financial irregularity when we all know your deposits will most definitely disappear within 10-60 minutes, they never get to almost zero and go back to your initial deposit. Ripped off case for fair trading issues - Any lawyers out there ?.

Hi Michdan

Glad you found the thread helpful. You are right that the principles are the same for slots. You probably know this - it is scientifically proved that a person gets just a big buzz from a near miss as they do a win so it is of no surprise that the software is programmed with a good number of near misses.

There are of course no reels really - again it is a video image which simulates reels spinning to keep you mesmerised !

You have tried and tried to win and just keep losing. This will continue for as long as you keep playing.

Hope you are keeping away still as these machines will eventually take everything and then move onto the next person who thinks they can win.

I wish you well with whatever you decide to do.

Dave

Hi Lost My Life

Glad you found this thread helpful

I admire your energy to get them banned or better regulated which would be great but you do need to stop looking for someone to blame. The bottom line is if you don't play them then nobody makes a penny out of you.

Could you imagine if everything that could lead to people getting addicted was banned ie drinking, smoking, drugs, viewing legal P**n on the net but to name a few. Although it's painful for those who do get addicted they are just a tiny percentage compared to how many partake in whatever it is causing the problem.

As I often said the FOBTs are not there for people to win on them - if everyone won the owner would go out of business. People are buying entertainment but the problem is it is very expensive and not many can afford the cost of that entertainment.

It isn't right that so much can be gambled so quickly in a shop, a casino maybe but the reality is the machines are there, usually 4 per shop and nobody is ever forced to play them.

By all means write to the MPs and do all you can but in the meantime make a stand by not playing them and using your experience to help and warn others who have not got the sense to see you cannot win long term.

Keep posting and keep hating the machines and remember if you don't play them they make nothing from you at all.

Best wishes

Dave

Quite surprisingly one of the bookies in town has closed. I looked through the window and all that remains are the stools provided for people to sit in a trance at the machines.

I feel for the people who worked there as they have lost their jobs but deep down got a kick out of seeing it empty.

I did wonder how many people have sat on stools like the ones in the empty shop today and mindlessly fed note after note in the machine and trudged out the shop destroyed by their loss.

I hope it was none of you guys on here!

Dave

About five years ago we had a bookies in our town that very surprisingly closed. Not just because it was the only one this particular firm had in town. Absolutely huge it was, it had everything, countless screens, comfy armchairs, numerous tables, even coffee tables. And of course four FOTB's.

Within a couple of weeks, the firm had opened a replacement shop, very much smaller, very basic in comparison, no luxuries, but of course four FOTB's.

About three months later they open a second shop, same as the replacement, very basic, but of course, you guessed it, four FOTB's. So now said firm have eight FOBT's in town instead of four.

As far as I'm concerned, this stinks. But perhaps this isn't immoral at all, just good business, and I'm just an old cynic.