Concerned father, who is now playing detective to try to ascertain the full extent of my Sons Gambling habit.
Single father of 2 Children, Son aged 24 and Daughter aged 22.
I currently reside some 20 miles away from my Son with my long term partner, she is aware of the developing situation but all other family members have no idea including my Daughter, his Sister.
He is renting the apartment from me although i have not received any for the past 8 months or so. He is flirting from one job to another, so i have been cutting him some slack until his financial situation improves.
I have also found out through his own admission that the Job he says he has is nothing short of a figment of his imagination. Basically he is lying to me, decieving me and generally become very untrustworthy. He did say a while back that he has been in a dark place and considered ending it all. The only reason he is still here is because he has a friend he confided in so he told me, but he wouldnt elaborate. He did lose his Mum at a young age, he was 11 his Mum was 36. He is a very popular person and has lots of friends he does though suffer from confidence issues. He is a bright young Man and on the outside he seems fine, inside i think he is full of torment? angst? He does seem to be bottling things up. He has become a person i don't recognize to an extent.
He did go to see a doctor on my recommendation and they told him to come back if things deteriorated. So no referral was put in place for possible depression/anxiety. I am at my wits end as to know how to proceed. The Gambling was only discovered the other day ( Wednesday 30th May 2018) when i came to the apartment and had a nosy round. 3 months worth of photocopied bank statements revealed he has spent over 4k on b****5 in the main £20-£25 a time with £150-£250 some days. He has though won roughly the same amount, which is no consolation. After digging deeper into his on line banking i have gone back 3 years and his statements do not make good reading, the Gambling habit was and is firmly entrenched.. I hate saying and thinking it but i dont believe a word he says at the moment especially after seeing the statements. I dont have contact details for his friends so that is a closed avenue. When i have confronted him in the past he is so convincing that when i leave him i feel satisfied that all is ok. Is he just a good liar? is this a trait he has developed. Have i been too stupid and in denial to the full extent of his issues, thinking and hoping that all will be fine.
Not really sure how to go about dealing with this, is it something he has to admit to and admit he has a problem and thus want help. I HAVE ALWAYS BEEN THERE FOR HIM AND ALWAYS WILL, and i tell him this all the time, is he ashamed, embarrassed or feel he has let me down and so he keeps the truth from me to avoid me being disappointed in him?
As a Father i have always been open and honest with him and have pleaded with him to TALK TO ME in confidence, its just a one way street and he promises "things" are ok. Is it something i have done?, said?, not done?, not said ? How do i broach this?
My Daughter also has issues but her situation seems to have calmed down somewhat, she is now Married, works in The RAF lives in Swindon and her Husband who is very supportive keeps me informed.
Both my Son and Daughter had differing reactions upon the death of there Mum.
Curtis was angry and Leanne upset. There Mum was a difficult person to navigate around and she had many issues but she did the best she could, we had split up a year before her death and i remained an ever constant in there lives. Curtis' Mum used to put him down regularly and call him names, your stupid, i hate you, i wish i never had you etc etc but none of this was said to Leanne at least while i was around. Leannes Mum idolised her.
I stiil talk to C and L about there Mum, in a good light and dont treat the subject as taboo, we have pictures and memories of the better times. Your Mum would be proud of you etc etc.
The above was copied and saved as i came accross a GA meeting for Thursday night 31st May 2018 local to my Son. So i thought i would take him down there. He didnt struggle or make excuses to get out of the meeting which i took to be a positive. Everyone at the meeting made us feel welcome and i was able to sit in as a by stander and also contributed my concerns. It was a very powerfull and emotional 2 hours and im hoping my Son got something out of it, he has promised to attend next week. The members have stated that it is not advisable for me to "drag" him to the meeting every Thursday, he has to want to go of his own desire.
I want to trust him and believe in the fact that this could be the beginning of something positive but he is living 20 miles away form me which gives him all the opportunity he needs to keep up his addiction. Should i make him move in with me and my partner and keep an eye on him, should i take away his debit card and or phone. He does though need to be Working as this would give him an outlet, a goal and some sort of focus in his life, but i cant physically drag him to the job centre or for interviews. Ive sent info relative to all sorts of jobs, he says he keep applying and gets some interviews but they dont amount to anything.
Ok, i think ive got a few things off my chest but still the problem of how to proceed persists, im going into the unknown and find this very frightening.
Yours
Chris aka terrified Father..... or is that terrible Father
Hi Chris. I am Cathy aka terrified mom... and just like you definitely NOT a terrible mom/dad:)
Dealing with addiction is terribly frightening. The addict is not your son... they are two different people. Thinking of it like that may help you to deal with things. Your son didn't ask for this addiction, however, he is the only one that can manage it. As much as we love our kids this is not our problem to fix and the more we try and help out the further they will get from "true" recovery.
You see at first as a parent we are happy for abstinence. Please anything to make them stop! Go to meetings, let me look after your money, show me receipts, etc. BUT if it all comes at our insistence it just amounts to abstinence which does not work in the long run as they end up being a passenger and not the driver in their recovery.
If you can do the absolute most difficult thing as a parent and sit back and let their story "play out" consequences and all your son will have a much better chance of being an active partner in his recovery.
This has taken me 11 years to see the light so to speak. It's not easy for either you nor your son but there is a light at the end of the tunnel. Reach out to all the support you can find for yourself. Find a Gam Anon (or if there isn't one nearby you can go to an Al Anon) and talk, and listen with others who know exactly how you are feeling!
Take Care
Cathyx
Hi Cathy,
Firstly, many thanks for your advice. As i said in my post this is all new to me and i have spent the last couple of days trying to get my head around it all. These things only happen in books, movies etc and certainly never to my nearest and dearest!!! think again im now saying!!! But your advice to just sit back and let the story develop without intervention is surely not the initial best way to go in my humble and i know inexperienced view!! If i took a back seat wouldnt that just project an uncaring couldnt care less attitude? I have to at least try to help arrest this disease and help fight it together? He will think i dont care, dont give a d**n!!! It sounds like you write from experience and have probably tried all sorts of methods. I know ulimately he has to help himself during this difficult time but with the knowledge that he has people on board who will be there for him no matter what. The Gambling issue is confined knowledge wise to just me and my partner, not sure if other family/friends need to know at this stage as its early days on the recovery road. He has been doing it for at least 3 years so i know it is entrenched to an extent. But we are at a starting point and so need to try this way first. Did you start out with a similar tact? I know addicts can be devious and untrustworthy. I have access to his on line banking, no gambling for 2 days, if he does start again then i will take his card off him and drip feed money for food and essentials. Failing that, take his phone and give him an old nokia 3310 that i have. I would then be taking away the oxygen and slowly strangling the disease on his behalf. I am hoping the GA meetings will be beneficial to him, being with other addicts and helping to support one another.
Did you have the same viewpoint as myself 11 years ago thinking that family and togetherness would somehow overcome this issue and then realising that you were doing more harm than good? Im still on the first mile of this marathon and im trying to find my way. Of course i need and want advice from people with the experience of gambling and how to cope and manage. These past few days have been the worst, but one day at a time is what im going to do and then act accordingly.
Thanks once again Cathy, your input is greatly appreciated, the fact you felt compelled to coment on my post and took time out is a true testemant to your feelings on this subject.
Best wishes
Chris
Chris , I could write a novel with all the ways I (and my husband) tried to help!! The last 11 years have been H**L for my son, my husband & myself, his sister and his brother (who actually moved continents to remove himself from the drama).
I know it sounds so cliche but this truly is a journey and we all do what we feel best and when and if that doesn't work we try a new tact. It would make your head spin to hear some of the ideas things that we have tried. Ultimately though we all end up back at the same place. Your son will work a recovery when and only when he is truly ready. Of course he needs to now you are there to support him. Unfortunately as parents our support quite innocently becomes spearheading their recovery and we end up putting more effort into their recovery then they do.
Addiction, lying and manipulation go hand and hand. You are going to lose that battle every time. Read and get as much information on addiction as you can. My son is now 29 and he has been a compulsive gambler since 18. We are a nice middle class family and nobody would ever suspect we have this dirty little secret. Addiction is the great equalizer...it does not discriminate.
You will get through this and come out the other side. Stay strong, set boundaries for yourself and please, please get some support/comfort from a support group.
Take Care
Cathyx
Hi worrieddotcom a sad story for you all. Cathy is right in an addict is the only one who can stop. My husband went GA and said he didn't need it anymore, wouldn't do it again. Secretly gambled for another few years with loans. Then just lunch money. He didn't want to stop. He's back at GA, done a year, still going. I go to gamanon. If you do take him to ga let him go in alone, then he can speak freely. He has to want to go back. Gamcare offer free counselling for you both individually. Gamanon is online Sunday nights 8-9. I think compulsive gamblers gamble as a way of escape, they're troubled and it takes them to another place. It's like an alcoholic drinking, self medication. Gambling becomes habit, learned behaviour, plus the loss of money instills the chasing of losses. So it becomes a cycle, a habit. You have to change that cycle. So if he's not willing to, you have to change what you do. That doesn't mean withdraw support, but it does mean withdrawing money, no bailouts. He has to be willing to go to the next meeting. Learning to live just for today. It's hard, always looking back at what you've done or not done. Thinking about future what ifs. Today is a new day, the only day that matters. There is lots of help out there, lots of blocks to put in place. If he wants you to manage his money take it. This is forever. My husband is an addict, always. He gets cash for a pint of milk, brings a receipt and change. That's how he wants it. They have to want recovery. There is probably a place where he could find some grief/bereavement counselling too. Stepchange help with debt. Ask questions here, keep posting.
Hi Chris, welcome to the forum so sorry to hear of this “disease” inflicting another family 🙁
As you gathered, Cathy speaks from bitter experience that until we are ready to work recovery ourselves, there’s little you can do other than be there for us. I’m sorry to hear of the pain you are all in with regards to your ex wife but hearing how she behaved towards your boy I am not surprised that he found his way into the arms of addiction. I still don’t know why I turned to it but it is a comfort blanket/crutch that promides us addicts a fairytale life: be that the high of a hit, the confidence of alcohol, the champagne Charlie lifestyle of the financially rich etc
As a gambler, I became an expert in manipulation, even managing to repeatedly convince myself the only way out of my spiralling financial mess was to throw more money away.
Dragging him back home under your roof & strangling the disease may allow you to keep tighter rein on his spending but as Cathy says, abstinence isn’t enough for most gamblers. Once I finally accepted I had a problem & needed help, I found stopping gambling relatively easy...The recovery not so much because recovery is way more than just quitting. It is about a whole new lifestyle & attitudes & for most people, learning to how to love themselves.
My mother is also a compulsive gambler & I cannot begin to tell you how important learning about addiction is for both sides of the fence (know your enemy) & would second GamAnon meetings if you can get to them. The helpline can also support you if you want to speak to trained advisors & please never underestimate how much this is hurting you.
I never had the tough love but I think if I had had that, I would have been forced to face up to my addiction sooner. GA is a great place to be but the program only works if he is willing to work it which is why people have said dragging him there isn’t ideal. Personally, I think the more he goes, the more he will see that he is not alone & hopefully will recognise the benefits & want to keep attending. Problem is, being found out doesn’t always bode as well as coming clean but I think it is very likely that he is all those things that you suggested, especially when he doesn’t have the means to gamble! Equally, he may be paying you lip service to get off his back because he doesn’t want to stop. There are no hard & fast rules as far as us addicts are concerned so the standard advice is to protect yourself 1st & foremost (with support & separate finances) & look after you - ODAAT
You have it spot on, Merry go round. As a recovering addict, with nearly 300 days consecutive gambling-free days under my belt, there is only one solution that's worked for me (so far - it's always day to day). That is, I have passed full financial control to my wife. Every penny is accounted for; I go to work with pocket money. I do not have cards or any other means of cash. Anything I buy on-line is purchased with my wife's card (I transfer money into it).
I will need to do this for life with no exceptions. There are disadvantages. For example, buying surprise birthday presents, or the joy of just buying something on the spur of the moment. Plus, if I am caught out in an emergency I don't have contingency. But I have a phone, and can always contact someone and work it out.
But the benefits. Respect from my wife (and selected family and friends who know - just a handful). My young son undoubtedly from the full attention he deserves - it's not just the money, but the time that gambling takes away. Financially, things are unbelievably better.
I honestly believe this is the best solution for long term success. Would I gamble without the financial blocks I've put in place? Of course I would. I know how faulty my willpower is in the face of this powerful addiction. This lifetime condition needs lifetime control. Some might might it emasculating, but I see this approach as a sign of personal strength, dedication and shows that you care.
I hope this helps, hope you didn't mind me chipping in to this thread, worrieddotcom.
P.S. Great advice as always ODAAT - the most important thing for anyone directly affected by gambling (partner, parent etc.) is to always protect their financial position. Don't ever get into financial difficulty on account of a compulsive gambler who, frankly, cannot ever be trusted in this regard - I speak from first hand experience. Hence why I cannot ever return to any financial control - I couldn't trust myself. It's all about facing facts.
I don't want to hijack your thread Chris. Mixer this is just my experience through years of experience but looking after a gamblers finances is NOT recovery. It is definitely important to couples where they have joint finances and can destroy a spouse. You say this Mixer
I honestly believe this is the best solution for long term success. Would I gamble without the financial blocks I've put in place? Of course I would. I know how faulty my willpower is in the face of this powerful addiction. This lifetime condition needs lifetime control. Some might might it emasculating, but I see this approach as a sign of personal strength, dedication and shows that you care.
This is not recovery this is abstinence. Abstinence is about willpower and recovery has nothing to do with willpower. My son went 1 year gamble free with me looking after his finances and unbeknownst to me he developed a drinking problem. He still had the same issues so found another way to cope once I had turned off the money. Then he found ways to get money (new CC's, payday loans etc) and now we have 2 full blown addictions to deal with.
Again this is not a knock on barriers (they absolutely have a place) but if that is all an addict is using they will never be recovered. They will be a "dry gambler".
Gambling addiction is NOT about money.
Sorry if I offended anybody as that is not my intent.
Cathyx
Hi Cathy (Amom)
Thank you for a very thought provoking post. I hadn't really thought about recovery and abstinence from this angle before.
I realise gambling addiction isn't about the money - I fully acknowledge it's about time lost and the effects of this insidious condition on ourselves and indirectly on others. There's more than that, it's truly a baffling, yet so devastating condition.
I have come to the conclusion, personally, sadly but pragmatically, that 'dry gambling' is all I can manage. I do not think true recovery is possible. I may be wrong!
I've tried hypnosis, counselling, GA (never got on with it, but I accept it's very well thought of) and that's my view. Day to day, with blocks that are rigidly and permanently in place are the way for me. No deviance and permanently reviewed. I share this view, but accept there are others!
I wish I knew what true recovery was, or how to achieve it.
Your experiences with your son mirror mine to some degree. I, too, reverted to drink but now have medical issues not fully yet come to light. I have abstained from alcohol for 10 days and intend to continue.
Maybe recovery is having having a moment of realisation brought on my life-changing circumstances. But it shouldn't have to come to this.
Chris, my I apologise for hijacking your thread but hope what's written nevertheless useful, incisive and relevant.
And thank you Cathy, you've really made me think. I'll write again on your thread once I've thought some more!
I thought, bring nearly 300 days gambling free, that things would be easier. Certainly, in some ways life is better but realise being gambling free is very hard work and Ibintend to continue.I resolutely maintain it's much better than the alternative.
Hi again,
A huge thankyou for all the replies with regards to my Sons ongoing situation, it is very much appreciated.
It makes me feel quite emotional that people would take the time to offer advice on how to move forward with my Son. We all tend to lead life at a 100 mph and dont have time for each other in todays society. Time... its our greatest enemy. Thank you for the time and effort you have made in contributing to my Sons addiction .
Some of the advice i will and have taken on board. I dont think i would be able to move forward with clarity without your kind words and support. Spoke again to my Son and he is saying all the right things....as usual, probably simply trying to placate me and ease my fears. He has informed a couple of his best friends and so they are aware of the situation, so he says!! How much has he revealed? has he indeed opened up and told the brutal honest truth? Has he actually told them anything or is it just a ruse to keep "Dad off his case"? He currently has £30 left in his account and no receipts forthcoming until the 15th. Which consitutes various benefits that he is apparently entitled to.He has no other accounts, loans or means of financial aid that i am aware of ( i shall keep on top of that) of course he could be being evasive and i am aware of that. I asked him "How are you going to finance yourself for the next 2 weeks without my or others intervention"? reply " My friends have said they will be there for me"!! The conversation between us played out in an agreable manner with promises on his behalf to "get his act together" He told me "he does it (gambling) because of boredom"!!!! I never thought he had time to get bored, he told me he was working and socialising. So not only is he gambling but he suffers from lethargy as well!! I can't hold his hand all the way on this journey that is obvious or i will become ill and be good for no-one. In no unceratin terms i told him he has to get out there and get a job...any job.. give your life some purpose, a goal to get up for in the morning, put some meaning into your life. 2 things he has promised me is that this week will see a change in him by trying his utmost on the employment front and secondly go to the GA meeting on Thursday night. I will be 20 miles away and so will not be holding his hand, i shall not even remind him again of possibly the most important 2 hours every week, every Thursday to avail himself for if he trully wants help. We are though due to meet up Tomorrow night at one of his friends Wedding reception, he is the Best Man and so he will be there for the whole day. I on the other hand have to go to work, so will see him in the evening. As its a special occasion for someone else i shall not bring up the issues that have brought me here but will seek out his "friends" who are now in the know, and will "look out for him" I will have a quiet word, "do not lend him any money"!!. If he fails this week to fulfill his promises then further measures will take place. Taking his bank card, taking his phone and replacing it with a very old perfunctary one which most wouldnt be seen with (no internet access). transferring any future credits made into his account and drip feeding a token amount to him for essentials and requiring reciepts for any spending he makes. Cancelling his broadband at the flat although he will probably say he need it for possible employment purposes.
We shall wait and see, i know some of you may think im still taking the softly, softly approach. But i want to try this method first and then carry out my threats/promises call it what you will, if he isnt treading down a positive route by the end of the week. I shall keep you informed of any future developments as they occur, time permitting. This can be like my journal and something to look back on regarding the journey my Son is taking. With luck he will do himself proud and be able to look back on this period of his life knowing that he fought the good fight against this demon of a disease that from the looks of it is becoming an epidemic.
Thank you once again from the bottom of my Heart for the interest you have shown, your support has been overwhelming and greatly appreciated.
Chris x
It sounds like you are being patient, kind but firm. Shouting and bawling at them is not always the answer and only you know how your son will react. In my experience treat his recovery as a project you can both do together. Get together and make a written plan of what actions are needed. i.e. get him to start a diary of gfree days and keeep counting the days, try to moniter his finances (not a cure but is a deterrent), get him to look at job sites, retraining, even voluntary work to get himself a start to a CV. Plenty of free activities if he gets bored. Get him a bike,take up running, local gyms, not expensive to swim. He probably is employable but needs his self esteem lifted to see that.Get blocks put on his phone for the gambling sites. Ring Gamcare to get advice on this and the P roblem in general. Learn as much as you can about this problem so you can hand him info. I know this sounds hard but do not trust his words easily at the moment - especially when he says "I am ok now" - "I won't do it again". He is still vulnerable to the temptation at this point. Still make him aware you will be looking out for him anyway and try and insist he attempts all on the list. If he is not in debt and has no loans etc. he is in a prime position to sart rebuilding his finances. It is hard not to bail them out but sometimes you are being kinder not to do it. If you both work together as we have here there can be light at the end of the tunnel It is not easy and it takes a hell of a long time but with a lot of parents on here we will go to the end of the earth to get our kids out of this. Good luck.
PS try not to do it all on your own. Get support from Gamcare and hopefully other family members.
Hi,
I’d urge GamAnon and/or CoDA. It’s also about changing your responses and learning how to protect yourself, so that your peace of mind doesn’t depend on whether he is, isn’t or might be gambling. That’s long term, beyond the scope of the forum, it takes time and commitment with the benefits to match.
CW
Chris,
If he is using a PC or laptop, get K9 software for it, YOU make the admin password and block all gambling options. If he tries to go to a website that is gambling related, it won't let him access it. It's impossible to delete too. You have to a clean windows install to remove K9.
GOod luck, it's a scummy horrible addiction that preys on vulnerable people. You're not doing anything wrong. Remember that.
Hi again,
Thanks once again for your input, its nice to feel im not battling this disease on my own and great to have people who are batting on our side. My Son apparently went tonight to his first GA meeting by himself, so this is his second time of attending. Thursday 19.30-21.30. He sent me a message via text at 21.32 to say " Hello Dad just finished, went well, similar numbers to last week (people in attendance) and told a bit of my story". I congratulated him for attending and asked him if its feeling like its benefiting him and also to ask about sponsors". He replied: "Yeh its benefiting me,and no nothing was mentioned about sponsors". Last bet he told them was 8/9 days ago. Realised earlier that Football was being played tonight England warm up, he never misses an England Game. 90% of his bets are football related, why do i have this nagging feeling that he went to the Pub with friends or stayed at the flat and watched the tv and so he is just appeasing me as he wants me to hear a version of positivity? Even though he might be telling me the truth i am starting to question everything he says!!! The World Cup is just around the corner a Gamblers nightmare!!
Thinking of turning up at the next meeting, look through the windows just to see for myself without him knowing i was there. I know its a bit stalkerish but its one way of knowing if hes stringing me along or not. I know lots of you will say you have to trust him and if he wants the help badly enough he has to attend. One of the common traits for Gamblers is being economic with the truth. I need to find out if hes a bare faced liar who hasnt reached the point of needing and wanting help or is he definately going and so trying to be proactive in his battle with the addiction.
One thing ive noticed having read posts all over the internet is that there is a common theme where addicts have to replace the addiction with other time fullfilling activities. Going to the gym, a run etc filling the time with something worthwhile and also battle in my Sons case the lethargy that seems to have enveloped him. The whole concept of thinking about Gambling 24/7 is totally alien to me but for his sake he needs to have other things going on in his life. I have this idea that he is going to go into betting overdrive during the World Cup. How can someone who has been Gambling constantly for 3-5 years suddenly abstain when probably the biggest sporting event is about to take place. The World Cup is i would imagine a bookmakers or online sites dream. I have started to notice the vast amount of Gambling commercials on the one eyed monster in the corner of the room when before discovering my Sons addiction i simply got up made a cuppa and didnt bother with the adds on TV. Its constantly in your face. Whilst i am not a Gambling addict i think though i have become a Gambling research addict!!.
Oh well, i have to remain positive that he really is meeting this evil disease head on. I actually find this Forum conducive to my sanity and writing this journal with my hopes and fears is quite therapeutic to me.
Take care all, i shall keep updating periodically.
One day at a time
chris.x
Hi Chris unfortunately you can't make him go if he chooses not to. I agree about the advertising but if a gambler has got to that point where they have realised their destruction they will see the adverts the same way we do. My husband turned off the tennis initially because too many ads. He's just over a year and can see them for what they are. i would say he would get support from others at the meeting once he has been to a few more, shows his commitment. So many come once, twice and never again, think they have the cure. Keep encouraging him to go. The World Cup makes us all edgy but to be honest if they're going to bet they will, regardless of what we say or do.
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