Is he manipulating me or should I think v carefully about my own behaviour?

Its a process isn't it I suppose. You are both embarking on a new relationship in which both parties need to find comfort and safety. My experience of it was pretty similar to what you've described. I wanted praise and recognition constantly and when it wasn't forthcoming because my wife was understandably suspicious of my motives, I would throw a strop and descend back into my self pitying mindset. I would retreat back into my own self in fear of criticism. On the other hand my wife did without doubt unconsciously use my misdemeanors to justify faults of her own. Whatever she said or did could be swept away with the words, it wasn't as bad as what you did. So how to move past the blaming & feeling blamed mindset you both appear to be in? Honesty. Try to set a time together where you can both speak freely without interruption. Just 10 or so minutes. Agree when that time is up the conversation finishes for that day. Listen to hear & understand each other rather than listening to reply

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Hi,

I have read your post a couple of times to try and be rational and impartial but the same thought keeps going through my head.

Is he really ready to continue fully with the recovery journey. I think not (sorry) and some alarm bells start ringing.

Tax issues. Any paperwork or audit trail? Surely there would be. If fully committed would he not ensure it was in place before speaking about it.

You don't listen to what he has to say or is it really you don't agree with what he has to say. Big difference.

You go off and do whatever you want or is it because he can't do the same.

Trying to pick a fight is an interesting one. When I was stopping smoking I would deliberately antagonize my wife so she would say have a cigarette for God's sake so you can be normal. I didn't quit my recovery. Someone else made me do it

His recovery us not going his way and he is making waves.

You ask is it me?. Your posts to us gamblers can be very short and very sharp sometimes and it is either black or white with no grey areas. For us outside your family circle it is definetely (in my case) what I need to hear and it does jolt me when I understand the pain of the OH. Guilt would be a great word to use. But is the same tact working with your OH? or does he know what buttons to push!!

As a wife you have tried everything possible now to help him and I salute you for what must be a huge effort undertaken and emotionally you must be drained.

It all boils down to communication both ways. Can you both find time to talk with no outside interference. Call it date night - whatever but it seems like you are heading for a make or break period. He doesn't seem to understand the gambling significance and when is it going to end. Is it going to end?. Is he having the gambling urges again?. Has he been backed into a corner so far all he can do is come out fighting?

The biggest question is does he really want to stop.

Best wishes

Thank you both for replying.

I also wondered about his commitment to a full recovery, he's skeptical about the literature (there's none in the house), I am not convinced that he has full regard for the Steps and he has criticised my inclination to believe everything I read at GamAnon instead of thinking for myself. But he does go the meetings, so surely that's something?

I get that I'm not perfect, I do need to change how I relate to him, I just didn't think I was that bad! And if I am and he can't take any more, then why the refusal to think of leaving in real practical terms? I just think that he wants to put me through my paces.

One of the problems is that the advice to a family member of an active CG is to detach so that you don't worry too much about the gambling. For parents that's slightly easier - not easy - because your children do grow up and make their own way in the world with your support. But detaching goes against the marriage guidance advice, which promotes unity and togetherness and partnership. Not that he would consider marriage guidance, he has refused outright.

This crisis may all yet blow over. But I'll close the last credit card account down just in case - it's the only one with headroom because I paid it. In all other respects, he would have to go to some trouble to find cash or credit to gamble with, the barriers are quite high.

And in the meantime, we'll have to try again to communicate without slinging blame.

Thanks again,

CW

Hi,

You are not that bad (lol).

Just another point when you mention practical terms which struck a chord with me.

A CG can think very well in practical terms regarding getting the next fix. On other aspects of life that thought becomes very irrational. Just a personal thought.

Best wishes

Hi CW

Marriage is hard enough without throwing in an addiction. We obviously all can be better people and better spouses. You are in the unfortunate position of having the history of lies and manipulation which just muddies the waters. While you have done what you have to to keep the marriage going (taking care of the finances, going to Gam Anon so you don't lose your mind) you are undoubtely still so very hurt and angry:(. It's so difficult being the f&f of a CG (wow thats a lot of acronyms!) though we are all certainly far from perfect we are left holding the bag so to speak and are also terrified of voicing our anger and fear in case it sets them off to the casino. For me it tends to feel like a lose/lose .

My son has been in GA for 1 1/2 years and has quite a few relapses. I often think he is not where he needs to be (arrogant on my part lol!) yet after each relapse he returns and seems to take a bit more on board. I think as Dan says its a process and everyones recovery looks different.

I think you are doing great! You have the finances buttoned down tightly to keep any damage minimal which is huge. As hard as it is maybe just try to ride out this hopeful "phase" and try to concentrate on yourself.

Take Care

Cathy

Hi CW,

My name may be Tootsie but I'm afraid I'm also cynical having put up with a CG husband for 10 years . My marriage is in a similar situation to yours. I dont listen to my husband because I have no respect for his views or thoughts. Communication is poor because I can barely look at him let alone talk to him .I feel, rightly or wrongly, that he has caused this situation and therefore he has no grounds to make any demands . It doesnt matter whether the way we feel is justified, it's how we feel and thats all there is to it. My husband doesnt want me to tell anyone about his gambling but that leaves me isolated and alone. He's having counselling but i have nothing. With regards to managing the finances, yes we can all do that but quite honestly I want a partner in my marriage, not someone I have to babysit. We start off trying to help etc but after having our efforts knocked time and again by relapses is it any wonder we get jaded. Harsh though it sounds, your husband's attitude sounds beligerant, which is a stage my husband also goes through following the remorseful stage. Your behaviour is a result of his and he should acknowledge and accept that.

Thank you all very much for all the comments, I do feel much better now because of this thread.

I think this whole blow out was a case of him making waves and Tootsie has spelt out how I do feel. With more time I may see the necessary changes in him which are lacking now but if not then I'll have to move on. In the meantime some self improvement would not come amiss but it doesn't consist of me letting him do and say what he likes. And we need to stop blamimg and communicate. Abstaining is a prerequisite for him but it's not enough on its own, he has to turn back into a human being.

Thanks again,

CW

Hi CW

​From what you say about your husband and GA it sounds as if he's going through some very common reactions to it. Dismissive of the literature, not interested in steps, trying to impose his thinking on how to best manage his illness. Check all the above been there done them, got the t-shirt, as have most people who stick with the program. GA & its program goes against everything we are taught from a young age about how to tackle our problems. We grow up being told that if we try harder, if we fight, if we are strong then we can do anything we want. GA teaches me none of those things will work when it comes to managing my addiction. It tells me to surrender & accept. To hand over the management of my disease to something or someone else. This is a concept completely alien to most. One people such as your husband who is in the very early stages of his recovery eil fight against tooth & nail. Hopefully over time he will stop looking for the things in the program he disagrees with & begins to understand that a little humility about the facts that his thinking around the way to manage his addiction hasn't worked out to well for him in the past will begin to surface. I know that doesn't really help you in your situation, but I'm just trying to explain this takes a lot of time. I suppose your question to yourself is how much are you willing to invest in him &whether or not the end product will be worth it. x

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Thank you so much, Dan.

Not that I'm being impatient, controlling or seeking immediate answers, perish the thought, but what do you think is a fair time to allow him to make the sort of changes that I'm looking for?

Thanks again,

CW

Ha ha indeed perish the thought! I'm afraid only you can determine what is an acceptable timeframe. It took me years, yet I see others get it very quickly. All depends on your level of arrogance around your addiction to begin with

​I suppose. Do you both actually know what the other wants from this? An addict tends to get very confused and therefore frustrated over there perception of others expectations of them. My wife and I found as you are experiencing now it very difficult to communicate without anger early on. So what we did was communicate by text! Bare with me! There were rules. You weren't allowed to reply for 90 minutes. This allowed us to actually listen to what the other was saying without any kneejerk reactions in trying to defend ourselves. Any anger had usually subsided by the time of reply, so a logical and appropriate response was generally managed (not always tho). Also writing a contract together of each others expectations and the common goals you both want from this can work well. It's not going to be easy & it can only work if you both want it to. Sometimes marriages fail, that doesn't just happen in relationships with an addict in it. Its about perspective again isn't it? Some would say 20 years & children to be proud is quite a remarkable success story & unfortunately it ran its course and came to an end. If you want it to continue, commit to the changes needed on both sides 100%, if that doesn't seem something you both are prepared to do then that gives you an answer also. I think what is the most frightening thing for both parties in these matters is the uncertainty of the situation. Try to reach some decisions together about which direction you both want to go because the journey always takes much longer if your facing in opposite directions. Dan x

Thanks, Dan.

I know barriers are important to you in giving you at least a little peace of mind. I wanted to make sure you were aware that an on-line gambler can easily gamble with cash. I could take cash into my local newsagents and be playing online in 5 minutes

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Hi, Dan,

Yes, I did know that you can get vouchers if you're so minded. And there's no self exclusion from the shops that sell them.

It's not impossible that he's found a loophole but all I can do is maintain high barriers. When discussing it with my eldest at the outset, we agreed that if he starts at Internet cafes or equivalent, knowing he'd have to leave home if found out, there's really no hope for him. At home, devices are blocked or password protected, my son changed the modem password, his phone is a brick although work v unhelpfully gave him a tablet, which may indeed have on line access. He says that on line access at work is blocked and in his industry it certainly should be. The tablet doesn't come into the house, we haven't caught it. And he does hand income earnt in cash over to me.

At the end of the day, I can't stop him if he's hellbent on doing it.

One question: my antennae are twitching slightly because one of the two weekly meetings that he attends regularly finishes v early, seems to be getting even earlier. Apparently they go straight through without a break but they're often done within one and a half hours, sometimes a bit less. Ours are two hours, as are the meetings in the other room. Does it sound odd?

Hope all is well with you. All the best and thanks.

CW

Morning CW,seems like you have as many bases covered as possible. As to the meeting, yes it is unusual but not unheard of, but usually meetings that are shorter are due to either time constraints at the venue or because its a specific type of meeting such as newcomers. What does seem strange is their need to get it over and done with asap. The coffee break can often be when the real talking begins

I would question why the rush, we generally run over time & then people are chatting afterwards for 10/15 mins outside. That said he does seem committed to going so well done for him for that. Maybe check the Ga website for meeting times ​

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