Rock bottom

I see where your coming from Paul but In my opinion and it is just that , If you feel youv'e got to the lowest point ( whatever that may be to the individual concerned) but then continue after a period of time to go back and do the same thing again , you cannot have reached the b.ottom , for me from the lowest point there has to be 2 choices left , you continue to go further down or you go up ? , your no longer just plodding along with everything remaining the same . As you say that for many can mean losing vast's amounts of money , relationships , possesions or all 3 the materialistics don't really matter as everyone has their own thoughts on what's important but the point is it will get worse if you continue along the same path so the " B.ottom has to be at a lower point .

Mine I truly believed was as I have said on many occasions after bad losses , borrowing more money secretly and vowing never again , when infact it came to a head sitting with my daughter at her 30th birthday keeping up the pretence of a happy family day and a proud father when only hours before the party I'd googled " Painless way's to die " simply because as much as I wanted to end it all , I couldn't imagine every throwing myself under a train , so you could say even at that point I was looking for an easy way out , the cowards way .

I'm not looking for an argument at all , indeed far from it but when your still an active gambler who knows what carnage your doing to not only yourself but more importantly those around you , yet you choose to still continue on that path , then you have not nearly had enough .

You will only stop gambling when youv'e done your worst and there's no more to give , mentally , phisycly , emotionally , when there's nothing left of you and it's sucked the life out of you , then you'll stop or maybe you won't ?.

But that's me Paul and how I felt and what do I know eh ? .

Alan....... I wish you hadn't signed off ' by what do I know ' and also agreed it's not an argument. I do somewhat though think we're agreeing somewhat in principle.

I also believe in the tough love approach and telling someone ( like myself ) that they need a different approach but I still haven't found an answer in how telling someone that they haven't found there ' rock bottom ' yet?can be beneficial support?. For my broken record I never did lose everything but I agree with Martins post from way back that there are basements to ' rock bottom ' ......

I do want to emphasise that I can't recall someone saying to some body that the reason they haven't ' cracked ' there addiction lark is because they haven't found there ' rock bottom ' ....

Think this is why I don't like labels...I refer to my turning point as rock bottom but I was merely peering over the edge of the precipice, still robbing Peter to pay Paul & successfully holding down a job. My ego still occasionslly considers "I wasn't as bad as that" but the harsh reality is I sunk to far deeper depths than many posters, but my arrogance kept me away from considering suicide. Calling it an illness isn't helpful to most people, half the stuff we post isn't helpful, we're addicts so knowing what is right & doing what we know is right is often poles apart...So call it what you will, I agree with Louis, don't wait, start today!

Morning Paul :)) .

In hindsight that last comment did sound as though I was spitting my dummie out a bit and I probably should have signed off with " What do any of us know " ? ( sounds better already ) ?.

Anyway I think your right and we agree in principle with a lot of what's been said , I just feel that as I've said if people keep doing the same thing after a particularly bad time that has brought them here and then go straight back to the same way of life , you need to ask the question " are you ready to stop " and " have you not had enough " ? at least if nothing else it may make you think a little harder about how bad they felt ?.

Were probably not going to agree much more on this subject , so if you don't mind I'll leave it there , at my age going around in circles just makes me fall over :)) .

Have agood day my friend :))

Very interesting discussion.
Everyone is different and so are the reasons for wanting recovery.
I appreciate that many do have that moment where everything changes, but I think it can be unhelpful to say 'you haven't reached your rock bottom' because its almost an invertation to willingly make your situation worse trying to get there.
Depression of some kind is often involved too and as stated earlier not everybody realises how depressed they are.

If your gonna Gamble then your gonna Gamble simple as that and again only my opinion but whatever you tell a compulsive gambler whilst in the grip of addiction and I'm including myself from experience it's not going to change that fact , only they and they alone can decide enough is enough and if and when that point is reached is down to them and to continue along the same path just screams to me your not there yet .

Thanks Louis for starting this thread and then ******** off :(( LoL ! .

Stay safe everyone :))

I suppose I'd just add that people tend to have a light bulb moment (or a series of light bulb moments until one sticks) which leads to longer term/permanent abstention.

But that need not necessarily be the same as a rock bottom moment (and I think the expression is a bit daft anyway as rock bottom implies you can sink no lower - but there are always new depths......perhaps apart from suicide).

But I would always encourage a cg to keep trying and to keep making positive changes regardless. I think you're far more lightly to have a light bulb moment/make that leap if you're in a better place.

Even if someone "can't" stop gambling - sort your work situ or family/friends or adopt a conscious policy of honesty or take an interest in something or do therapy.

Create conditions conducive to stopping. Given that addiction is a symptom, if you can chip away at improving your lot then the addiction loses its fertile environment.

Even if you don't stop then, hey, at least your living a more fulfilling life. Win win.

Try a new approach but never give up.

Nice post Cardhue - that was a pragmatic approach to an horrendous addiction. Keep chipping away until the day something 'clicks' it could be at the first opportunity or much later. I agree that there is never a rock bottom as you can just keep sinking so no point holding out for that rock bottom day to arrive.

I just think we have to get through to new members and I wouldnt really discuss that they havent reached a rock bottom yet. Sometimes Ive mentioned it but mainly try to ask if they are ready to act on the advice.

I see posts and I have developed a sixth sense because Ive been there. I started advising people before I was even ready to do what was needed to stop myself. I wrote some nice words but thinking back it was all so false as if I was in a position to advise anybody at that stage. I mentioned the right steps to take but wasnt doing them myself.

I now thank the person who pointed it out to me. However at the time I was angry with them and deleted all my posts in a huff. I felt a fraud and I had been caught out. At the same time I felt indignant and righteous. I went off gambling yet again and thought stuff em! Thats how deeply, deeply confused I was in the early stages. I was not ready to stop then because I was doing nothing effective to tackle the addiction. I was relying on "willpower" alone which was not working

I really dont want anybody to reach rock bottom but think we have all had some form of rock bottom before joining the Gamcare forum. I agree that it has to be faced but it can end up like some sort of Python sketch....you think you had it bad...we used to work 24 hours a day and live in a sceptic tank.....blah blah. You know what I mean...theres a danger of it coming over like a twisted badge of recovery membership

When I was ready everything just felt right. It was like an out of body experience. I felt so uplifted that day as I excluded. I later picked up the phone and it felt so right to get the words out to my family. I wanted no more gambling and those were the right things to do as previously advised .

I see many people who post once ot twice and I wonder how they are. I fear they are not ready. Its a horrible addiction. A chink of light can make people post on the forum then I fear they are gambling again.

Best wishes to everyone

Interesting posts, all relevant in there own way nobody right nobody wrong we are all different people different things work for different people.

I have had serious addition's to many different things and still have one that I am determined to beat smoking, the one thing I have learnt about all of the addiction the person has to want to stop, they have to want to change there lives, only when the person has reached that point of wanting to stop will they accept help and support from others.

Good luck to everyone

Stay Strong Stay G/f

Malc

Random alert

Addiction has a very small mouth but with an appetite of an elephant, then takes you on a downward spiral, the ' rock bottom ' is when the elephant lands on you at the bottom of the spiral, Or you can get off or slow down the spiral by creating conditions that counteract the addiction.

Despite this debate kinda drying up, I never really got the answer I wanted and the discussion kinda went around in circles.

I kept it going in 3d, and come to the conclusion that's it's the sides peace of paper. I do prefer hearing things I don't want to hear that want to hear as I feel it's important for growth. But I've flipped my stance, where saying to someone hasn't found 'there rock bottom yet' can also be akin to saying to someone that ' your way to comfortable ' . I prefer the latter, it's not as harsh and when your relapsing over and over, you need a hand up not a kick up..

volcano wrote:

Despite this debate kinda drying up, I never really got the answer I wanted and the discussion kinda went around in circles.

I kept it going in 3d, and come to the conclusion that's it's the 2 sided peace of paper. I do prefer hearing things I don't want to hear that want to hear as I feel it's important for growth. But I've flipped my stance, where saying to someone hasn't found 'there rock bottom yet' can also be akin to saying to someone that ' your way to comfortable ' . I prefer the latter, it's not as harsh and when your relapsing over and over, you need a hand up not a kick up..

So Paul is it a bit like saying " You can't polish a ***** but you can roll it in glitter " ? :))

I'm not going around in circles with you anymore :))

Have a good night Buddy :))

Shoot Alan, we're agreeing again, albeit your glitzy ***** 2 sided peace of paper smells a bit more..