this forum is a load of c***!!!

Hi DeadspinBill,

I won't judge you my friend, because there have been times where I felt exactly the same about FOBT's.

If you really want change, then I would approach your local MP, your local goverment/council and anyone of a similar nature that will listen. I have gone down this route personally, and it has got some attention, which may contribute to the larger problem at hand.

GAMCARE only deal with the addiction itself; if that had opinions on the industry, then they couldn't be impartial. Don't blame them my friend, it isn't their place to get involved - there are plenty of other mediums and methods of making your voice heard.

I once bet 50.00 on red 28 times in a row, and it came up black, 28 times in a row. I also had the maximum 13.80 on zero, and it rolled in four times in a row - those kind of outcomes defy belief, certainly, but as I said to you before my friend, the main thing is you - I was gambling fifteen years before FOBT's came along, mostly on Fruit Machines that were designed to be rigged and represent false outcomes to ensure that compulsive behaviour is capatilized on.

This is why FOBT's don't really matter, personally speaking, because there would always be something else, even if it didn't drag us in quite as much.

I respect your opinion my friend, but all these negative feelings only serve to drag you down deeper without tackling the problem at hand - heal yourself, and then campaign against FOBT'sd with a clear, practical and objective head if you choose to. I wish you well.

JamesP

hi deadspinbill, try the G**** forum if you want, more proactive about action re the FOBT's etc.

In a nutshell the only 'good' gamble is a + EV bet, few and far between, e.g. if you are offered 6-4 about the flip of a fair coin. Otherwise if the odds are against you then you might as well chuck your money away, or better still give it to charity rather than give it to the bookmakers so they can live in ever posher houses. Are you a masochist on a self-destructive trip ? You know the machines are rigged, you know if you play them you will lose, so why touch them ? If you must gamble then be more 'professional' about things, aim at the very least for a fair game. I think you play them because you enjoy the masochistic sense of outrage you feel at confirmation the machines are bent. Wake up: dishonesty, greed & corruption rule in this nation right now.

I am sorry to hear of your problem Bill.

The FOBT or roulette machines are without doubt the worst thing that ever happened within the offline part of the betting industry.

The issue I have with the whole ''ban the FOBT'' idea is that surely this means that the problem is just being totally shifted rather than resolved.

JamesP you obviously know your stuff so I am sure that you will know as much about the whole FOBT issue as anyone else may do.

As things stand, even if they are banned in shops the exact same roulette games will still be available 24/7 on every online casino. Surely this is more worrying, as every man and his dog will have if anything much easier access to these destructive machines and the devastation they cause.

Personally I believe that the best way of dealing with the problem is through personal banking. By this I mean contacting your bank and asking them to set a daily limit on your account, on how much you can deposit online in any given day.

This has to be feasible in this world full of technology that we live in.

As Davey says we don't live in an ideal world when it comes to money. So as harsh as it seems we have to resign ourselves to the fact that legalised industries that earn billions of pounds for bigwigs and governments are more or less here to stay, in some form.

Basically I agree with your point Bill, but gamcare would without doubt ban all FOBT machines today if they had that option.

They don't, so it's up to people like you and them to try and live with the problem and deal with it the best you can.

Good luck.

Bill mate, I have to agree with the other comments here - Gamcare are the good guys; yep, they are funded by the industry but all they care about is people's well being. Knock on a few doors if you want change in legislation, get a petition together, join the groups against FOBT's - I don't like them either - I once saw a bloke cover every number apart from one, and that came in five times. As JamesP says, the main priority is sorting yourself out - get that done, and then put everything into making some serious noise. This Forum isn't C**P, it just has nothing to do with what the industry does and how it does it - you can have opinion, but all this website is dedicated to is getting people through their compuslive gambling habits. You should get angry with yourself first, and then everything else second - that is the bottom line matey.

In my experience, it is much easier to blame others than take a long, hard look at yourself.

All this judgement, all this anger, all these words directed at those who only work here to help others - if you channelled all that into getting yourself help and getting yourself through this addiction, then it would serve you a lot better than just pointlessly venting.

You will probably find those with far worse "hard luck" stories on FOBT's - 8 "dead spins" is nothing to what I have seen and read about, on here and online. To be honest, the game is the same, in the casino and the Bookmakers - you go through periods of being massively up and massively down, as well as having incredible "luck", and then incredible "bad luck" - they aren't rigged, they have been investigated and regulated, but the game is designed for you to lose in the end, and to feed off compulsive behaviour as someone else has written here.

Bill, I think you know they are legit - you have probably won again since writing this, and are convincing yourself that they are ok. I don't feel you really believe they are rigged, otherwise you wouldn't play them at all - you have, and still are, knowing all what you know.

Get help, get advice, and direct all these negative thoughts in a more postive direction. We have all thought like you have, but it has got us (and you) absolutely nowhere - what works it forgetting about all forms of gambling and moving forward, zero tolerance. Forget everything else.

To graham G

Yeah I'm an a*** I been back today and again I got robbed legally as u put , again I swear its not bad luck these machine are rigged to take in money !!!

Ok 33 numnbers covered this time 4 dead numbers and bamm 28 gone! The screen popped up and said iv been playing 30 minutes and spent 101.20 - the last 20 I put in made up 20 minutes of the session . I swear I've seen too many times now a losing spin to not believe these are random and far too many people say they are getting robbed everytime they play with same losing patterns based on low returns

It really is just b*** now

Seen it happen to a friend today 65 spin 36 out of 37 numbers covered and bamm zero twice took 1000 under 40 minutes no return

Ban these rigged unfair gambling machine that

The machines are set to pay out when they've taken in certain amounts of money.

(just like fruit machines are)

This is why the odds are fixed & its all run by a computer.

If a machine is in "take" mode then it will make you think you're about to win with near misses until it's emptied your bank accounts.

I've never been on a FOBT as they never interested me but fruit machines always seemed bad enough to me, it's pretty obviously the same principles.

If you want random then you'd have to find a proper roulette wheel, and even then the house has an edge.

Bill, you are not an a***, but you will be if you keep going round and round in circles and not listening to others that have beaten and come through FOBT addiction; as myself and everyone else has said here, tackle your own problems first.

Those machines and the industry are not the problem, you are, and you are ultimately responsible for your own life, which you are flushing down the toilet by treating the machine as the issue, and not you.

You are not a bad person, but what you are doing and saying is making you one; this bitterness and anger is only going to multiply and you may end up with more regret than you can handle, with your whole life, day and night, haunted by the mistakes you have made.

Are we going to get another post, talking about lost money "dead spins", or are we going to get one where you have self-excluded, gone to GA, phoned GAMCARE, or gone several days without gambling? Get a grip, put these machines out of your mind and push yourself; your actions are the problem, your routine is the problem

Hi Bill, good to see you have had some positive and supportive comments here.

I have to echo Graham C's comments about another post, talking about your losses.

If you read the "Friends and Family" section, you will read many, many comments from partners of compulsive gamblers who cannot understand why their partners lose everything, but still come home and take out their negative feelings on them.

You are doing the same my friend. You feel robbed, frustrated, angry, but all you are doing is deflecting the responsibility of your own actions - FOBT's wouldn't exist if no-one played them; the sad fact is that you are part of the problem my friend, and you struggle to accept who you are.

It is your choice my friend. How would you feel, five years from now, if you were still posting here, complaining about how much you lost and how you believe them to be rigged? Is this the kind of future you want? Those years will slip by in the blink of an eye, trust me on that, and it may leave you with more debt and regret than you can handle. You can't ignore the problem my friend; you have to stare it straight in the face and be proactive.

I hope today is a better day for you,

JamesP

Are you really on a self destructive button gambling is winning then losing you will never win that is the whole point you will never win in the end you can't blame the tools it's you ok you enjoy it or did accept it you have a lost untilyou do you will self district like a lot of us have.

You have three choices self destruct

Carry on Blaming gambling

Accept you have lost what you had won't come back

I don't know how Much money you have to burn but you will soon be owing out so much you won't know where or why you will never win in the long run but I think you are attention seeking take heed else it will ruin you too

Suzanne

Yeh my problem is that I gamble and when I gamble I play a computer game which is set by the law to play fair and give random results for a fair result but the machine on which I gamble on iS rigged thurs to rob the player of their money so as the results are unbelieveable I plough in my money chasing back the lost money

So there are thousands of players like me losing money on a system designed to take our money on unfair results

So fobt need more explaining to users as players are addicted on the belief that the games completely FAIR and the results given are a fact of complete chance

Don't bother me with why would ppl cheat because history can tell you of frauds of the past especially in sports oh yeaaah and betting

I truly thinking remove an item which takes money unfairly and only seems to get away with it by paying a divey to Govmnt

My problem may not be as bad as others I'm not saying I'm the worst , I don't bet on horse,dogs football etc etc but I see more money lost in the bookies on these machines than the 50p bets the old boys put on in shops

But you hit the same tune its me me me la la la. Yepp I played thinking its down to luck and I believe to feel from playing many times that these machines are not a fair gamble so I stop then I get confident again believe it is completely random and I must of been havin bad luck as cuz if u lose it must be down to bad luck as these machine as everyone says they are legal and play fair and its the same old story note after note chasing back money taken from unfair results . gang up if you like ...

off my point of getting those b******t fobt machines gone from betting shops if this happen it would save more lives than it would cost .

END OF I'm not so big headed I won't have anyother views all I goning to say on this subject is the ppl who run the gambling in the uk need to really look at fobt as a problem which will never go away as we all know companys need to make profits and where are they going to get that from ?? Us and the next suckers , maybe we are all stuck in a vice and gambling is hiding the Real issue I don't know I know I don't have many options open apart from chase fast cash but seem to be losing it faster than it comes

U say to me stay away don't go in bookies but wat abt the bloke who's now in the hotspot and the one after that and the one after him and so on and so on its never ending maybe I'm mad or maybe u can see the pattern

Ps I don't want to harm anyone or offend anyone or disrupte anyones recovery from any form of gambling addiction , I just felt this wud be one place where u cud vent ur anger towards the system and gambling and somewhere when ur at a low point say how u feel cause it like no other pain inside when you lose your last bit of money and have nothing except a bad memory of shuda cuda wuda running around ur mind

I spoke to my local mp and all he wanted was lower stakes as the volume of money put it was exceeding in his words

Hi Bill

Firstly I must apologise to you for coming across harshly I am just in despair at the mess I am in and I do not want anyone else to go down the road I am in at the present

I have lost thousands on the online slots And I am not playing them anymore because I know I can't win

Of course you must do what you have to do I wished that all slots and machines were fair but I now know they are not

Good luck on your quest and I do hope you come through as a winner which ever road that is

Best wishes

Suzanne

Bill, no-one is ganging up on you - people are trying to help and have taken a lot of time to give you good advice; it feels like you have thrown that back in their face because you ignore what people have written and then launch another full-scale rant.

I am not saying you are a bad person, but what you are doing helps no-one; you are cheating yourself by not admitting you do these things - at the moment, you are putting yourself on a pedestal, trying to take the moral high ground by looking down on these things, yet you can’t stop, you are part of the reason why the government and the industry does so well out of them. What you have written is a complete waste of time and energy, and this isn’t the place to do it - people come here because they recognize that they have a compulsive gambling addiction (just like you have) and want help and support. It is not a question of who is better, or whether the machines are rigged - that is completely irrelevant.

This is an open Forum Bill, and people are likely to say things you don’t want to hear, but you can’t avoid the truth, and the truth is that you are throwing your life away and spiralling out of control - you believe these things are fixed, but it isn’t enough to make you stop playing them - can’t you see?

I wish I could help you, I wish you could read and appreciate the good advice you have been given here but I have seen hundreds of others like you who are just no prepared to stop, face facts and do something about it -you are about to make things far, far worse than you ever imagined; until you stop and get help, you can wave goodbye to your finances, your love life, your friends, your family, your career and your physical/mental health. I see it all in what you are writing and how you are acting. If you feel differently, then do one simple thing - never playing these machines again.

Hi again Bill, I don't post much as you can see but I have worked in the industry all of my life so I am more than qualified (hopefully) to make comment on what these machines are doing and have done to good people like yourself.

You have come on to and posted on the most obvious public forum there is currently available for people with problems with FOBT machines.

That is what you have done, and total fair play to you for doing so - it takes a lot to do that and I would guess that 99.9% of people on here respect you purely for making that step.

But you are still trying to defend your actions and your words to every post that is made. The people who are making these comments and trying to help you are all people who have been in the same dungeon as you have been, so just try and take a little step back and realise that sometimes we all need some form of assistance in life.

The only way you can fix this problem is to stop playing roulette machines full stop.

Until you accept that fact you will just be an angry person who struggles to sleep at night.

Keep posting on here, trust me people are only here to help you for no financial gain.